Lib Dem leader Ed Davey on NHS spending, Brexit and more election stunts

Ahead of his speech at the Lib Dem Conference, Cathy Newman speaks to the leader of the Liberal Democrats, Sir Ed Davey, about how they’ll work with the government on issues like the NHS.

Cathy Newman: Sir Ed Davey, you’ve talked about fighting to fix the NHS, so can I take it from that, that in extremis you’re prepared to vote against the budget if the government doesn’t put more money into the NHS urgently?

Ed Davey: Yes

Cathy Newman: And that’s a no-brainer?

Ed Davey: Yeah. I mean we fought the general election on NHS and care. It was our top priority. It was our top spending proposal. We had an affordable, costed budget for investing in primary care, in social care, in repairing our crumbling hospital buildings. And we’re calling on the government to make the budget on October the 30th, a budget for NHS and care.

Cathy Newman: And higher taxes to pay for that. You’re up front about that?

Ed Davey: Yeah, we’ve said that they should reverse the tax cuts the Conservatives gave to the big banks. We’ve also talked about capital gains tax reform, which is paid by the wealthiest and the billionaires. So we said in the general election, I’m repeating that, frankly, there were ways of raising the money so you could get that investment in our NHS and care.

Cathy Newman: You’ll work with Labour. You’ll sit down and talk to them as soon as the conference season is over about how to fix social care?

Ed Davey: Well, I hope they’re prepared to work with the opposition parties. I mean, our style as to be a much better opposition to the Conservatives, is to be constructive and prepared to work cross-party. However, when it comes to things like properly investing in the NHS, we’re hearing from the government that they want to do reform before they invest. The Democrats want to invest and reform.

Cathy Newman: So is it the government that’s your main target or is it the opposition? Because you’ve talked about finishing the job, defeating the Conservatives. Are the Tories the bigger target for you, really?

Ed Davey: The Conservatives don’t share our values. Indeed, increasingly, what’s quite dramatic in our politics is, I think lifelong Conservative voters have drifted from the Conservatives because they no longer share the values of those people. You know, things like the rule of law, law and order, compassionate politics, decency in politics. The Conservatives have moved away and people have looked to us in many of the seats we’ve won, in seats we could win in the future, as the real owners of those values – that most adhere to them.

Cathy Newman: Where you set out your policies at the moment, they are to the left of Labour. So for example, on immigration, you talk about wanting new safe routes for asylum seekers. You want more money for the NHS and higher taxes to pay for it. You oppose means-testing the winter fuel allowance. You want to scrap the two child benefit limit, I mean, how many Tory voters are going to be attracted by these kinds of policies?

Ed Davey: Huge numbers. I disagree with your characterisation of this being left and right. Look at the NHS and care. I don’t think that’s a left-right issue, actually. When we talk to lifelong Conservative voters, they agree with us on the NHS.

Cathy Newman: Wanting higher taxes? Wanting capital gains taxes higher?

Ed Davey: I think the vast majority of Conservative voters would be willing to pay that price.

Cathy Newman: A lot of conservatives in southern England, where you won seats, would love to rejoin the EU. You mentioned it as a kind of footnote in your manifesto. When are you going to be more confident – use that amazing victory you’ve been talking about as a launchpad to say, yes, let’s rejoin the EU?

Ed Davey: Well, I’m glad you raised Europe because it’s an issue that we’re passionate about because, as you know, we are passionately pro-European.

Cathy Newman: You’ve got a funny way of showing it, though.

Ed Davey: Well let me show you a little bit more now. First of all, it is good that the new government is prepared to talk to our European colleagues and try to rebuild that relationship. That’s a big improvement on the Conservatives. I also think we need to say loud and clear that our objective is to rejoin the single market.

Cathy Newman: But I’m not hearing you say you want to rejoin the EU. Yes, in the distant future sometime. But you passionately believe in the UK being in the EU? I’m not hearing that.

Ed Davey: Well, what I’m saying is we’re passionately pro-European, and the way to do that, if you’re a responsible politician, is to rebuild that trust.

Cathy Newman: I’m definitely not hearing how brilliant it is. If the UK was to rejoin the EU.

Ed Davey: Cathy you know that we opposed the Brexit deal.

Cathy Newman: Yeah but you can’t shout about that because you’re worried about these Tory voters you’re trying to appeal to, who might not want to rejoin the EU.

Ed Davey: Isn’t that an interesting thing? I’ve met lots of Conservative voters who actually think Brexit hasn’t worked very well. I’ve met a lot of Conservative voters who didn’t vote for Brexit.

Cathy Newman: So you think it’s a vote winner, potentially, rejoining the EU?

Ed Davey: Well, being pro-European and showing a responsible way to mend our relationship with Europe is, I think, a vote winner.

Cathy Newman: You arrived here on a jet ski. I mean, does your heart ever sink when your Comms guys say you’ve got to get into another wetsuit?

Ed Davey: Oh no!

Cathy Newman: You love a wetsuit?

Ed Davey: I say, look, is it a day for a dry suit or a wetsuit?

Cathy Newman: What’s the next stunt then? Show a bit of leg on the next stunt?

Ed Davey: Well, what I will say is in the general election, one or two stunt ideas were rejected. One was rejected because, you know, if you’re being interviewed underwater, the microphones don’t work.

Cathy Newman: So it was a scuba diving stunt that was rejected?

Ed Davey: Well, you know, I think some of our opponents wanted me to swim with sharks and we weren’t going to do that.