‘We have to show people there is hope’, says Work and Pensions Secretary

We spoke to Work and Pensions Secretary Liz Kendall – whose department has announced an initiative to help people back into work. I put it to her that working people will find a 50% hike in capped bus fares very difficult to live with.

Liz Kendall: I really do understand how vital buses are for people to not just get to work, but to get to college, to get to their local hospital. But you’ve got to have it on a sustainable footing. You’ve got to have the finances there because you’ve got to be able to afford to pay for them. We’ve got to get the economy growing again. That means investing in the long term, the infrastructure and the jobs of the future. But it also means getting Britain working again, which is why the announcement today about £240 million to help get people into work is so important.

Krishnan Guru-Murthy: You’re spending £240 million on disabled people and the long-term sick. How much are you going to bring the benefits bill down when that works?

Liz Kendall: Well, listen, we have a situation at the moment where this country is the only country whose employment rate hasn’t gone back to pre-pandemic levels. And we have an almost record number of people out of work due to long-term sickness and 1 in 8 young people not in education, employment or training.

Krishnan Guru-Murthy: What’s the cost benefit prediction on this? Are you expecting to bring the benefits bill down by more than you’re spending?

Liz Kendall: We certainly want to see spending on what I would call the cost of failure – if you’re written off, not given support when you actually want to work, which many people do. That is too much money being spent on the cost of failure. We also want to see…

Krishnan Guru-Murthy: Will this cost or save money is the question.

Liz Kendall: Well, I think this is about making sure that if more people are in work, they’ve got better living standards for themselves, they’re able to contribute to the economy for businesses so they can expand and their taxes can go to our vital public services. You’ll hear more about our plans when we put forward our white paper in the coming weeks.

Krishnan Guru-Murthy: You’re an experienced political strategist. I want to ask you about, do you think Labour has got the big picture of the politics of all of this wrong? You know, you alienated millions of pensioners over the winter fuel payment. You’re now annoying lots of people who get buses. It just feels like you’re sort of getting the politics of this wrong so that your message going into this budget ought to be about how you’re changing people’s lives, how you’re fixing everything that was broken. And instead it seems to be about all the people who are losing as a result of this Labour government.

Liz Kendall: I think it is really hard after such a long period of a different government with a completely different approach, to tell the sort of truth about what’s happening in the country. About the state of the public finances, the state of our economy and the long term decisions we need to take to put that right. We have to show people that there’s hope, because I think families in their own lives know sometimes they have to take difficult decisions about the state of their house or what they’re doing as a family. But they’ll come with you if they believe there’s a better future ahead.

We’ve got a lot of work to do. I mean, we’ve got a lot of work to do on public services and the economy and with our businesses, but also with the public. But it is the analogy of the house. It is true, if you don’t sort out the damp or the roof or your foundations, you just try and paint over. I’ve done it myself, Krishnan. I’ve painted over damp. It doesn’t work. You’ve got to rip it out. You have got to fix it and put it right. And that is hard and it costs money.

Krishnan Guru-Murthy: It’s all sounding a bit George Osborne.

Liz Kendall: Well, it’s not. We’ve actually got a plan, a longer term plan. And the key is this. Our economy hasn’t grown. Why? Because levels of investment have been low for years and we’re lagging behind other countries, similar countries. And because our employment rate actually hasn’t gone back to pre-pandemic levels either, and we have got far, far more people out of work due to long-term sickness. It’s like a car. A car needs fuel, petrol in the engine or electricity now, in the engine to drive it. And that’s the investment. And it needs people with the skills. And together, that’s how we’ll get the economy going, to create the money to put into people’s pockets and their public services. Can’t change it overnight. But we’re going to make a start.