Interviews with the fugitives: Hunted Series 2

7 September 2016

Ayo and Madu Interview

Ayo:

What made you want to take part in Hunted?

I thought it would be a really exciting thing to do. I thought it would be an opportunity for me to test my skills, and to do something other than go to work. It was a way of breaking up the monotony of life.

 

You went on the show with Madu. How do you guys know each other?

I’ve known him since I was about 12. We met at a library, on the computer. At the time, we didn’t have a computer at home, so I went there to use it, and Madu had booked to use the computer after me. We both had a passion for computers, and the friendship developed from there, really.

 

And you both work with computers now?

Yes, both of us are IT professionals, we have very similar types of jobs.

 

Did you think that your computer skills would be beneficial, and did that turn out to be the case?

Yeah, I did think those skills would come in handy, and my general awareness of technology, how it works from the technical point of view. And yeah, it definitely did come in handy while I was on the run.

 

What did you think the experience would be like making the programme, and how did the reality match up to your expectations?

That’s a really hard question. I didn’t have any real expectations beforehand, I just knew it would be challenging, I knew it would be fun, a bit of an adventure, a bit random, ending up in totally random places. But I’d never done anything like this before, so I didn’t know how I’d feel, or how the story would unfold. In the end, I found it very challenging, enjoyable and exciting. I enjoyed the whole experience.

 

Did you go into it with loads of detailed plans, or did you just go where fate took you?

I just compiled a list of people that I’d met over my life in different places. Old friends, people I knew at University, people I’d met in the pub, all sorts of people. I didn’t really have a plan, but I thought if I had a list of contacts, some of which were pretty obscure, that would hold me in good stead. That was the only bit of planning I did, the rest I played by ear.

 

You’ve got a partner and a two-year-old daughter. Was it hard being away from them?

Yes, it was tough. But I think it was quite valuable as well, it helps you realise how much your family actually means to you when you’re away from them for so long.

 

What was the toughest aspect of the whole experience?

I’d say maybe the emotional side of it. You have to interact with so many different people, and different types of people. From one day to the next you wouldn’t know where you’d be, or who you’d be with. Trying to adapt your persona to fit wherever you were and whoever you were with, or potentially even lying to them a bit, giving them a false name, I found that quite tiring as the days went on. Being a chameleon I found quite draining.

 

Did you find yourself getting paranoid?

You definitely get very paranoid. I don’t think I’ll ever look at a CCTV camera in the same way. “Who’s behind that camera? What are they doing? Will they see me? Has it caught me?” There were times when I was very paranoid, and maybe times when I was over-cautious. But you don’t get a second chance, if you get caught, you get caught.

 

How did you and Madu get on?

We argued quite a lot. I go left, he goes right, he suggests we go left, I want to go right. I think Madu is quite selfish, to be honest. In general, we didn’t really get on that well, put it that way.

 

Did you learn a lot of what not to do by watching the first series?

A little bit. I do think, from the first series, most of the people got caught doing really fundamental things like phoning their wives for half an hour. I don’t think I learned that much from the last series, maybe a bit about the hunters, and how extensive their network is, and how extensive their skills are. It helps to know who you’re up against?

 

Did you form bonds with people when you were away? Did you meet people who were a really big help to you?

Yes, I met loads of people who were a really big help to me. I call them heroes, because they helped me out so much. And the cameraman, the guy I was with 24 hours-a-day, I think me and him will be friends for life. We had such a good time together. Generally, he ate hat I ate. If I didn’t eat, he didn’t eat. He slept where I slept.

 

Were there any particular high or low points in the whole thing for you?

I’m not sure how much I’m allowed to say. One of the low points that was really irritating about being on the run was doing a lot of camping. I hated camping. I’d bought some safety boots, builders’ boots, with metal toe caps. And when it gets freezing, that steel gets freezing, and your legs get freezing. There was a time when I was up on a mountain, sleeping in a quarry with sheep. That wasn’t very comfortable.

 

How do you feel, looking back at the whole thing? Is it an experience you’d recommend to others?

Definitely. I’d definitely recommend it to others. I don’t think it’s a thing for everybody, though. If you’re going to be homesick and think about your family all the time, then it’s not for you. Or if you’re not prepared to be uncomfortable, and go through rollercoasters – like I say, we slept in a quarry, but we also slept in a million pound house at one point. There’s lots and lots of variation. I’d advise anyone to watch the show, and ask themselves if they really have what it takes.

 

What would you say you learned from this experience?

I learned quite a lot, actually. I learned that camping is probably not that bad – even though I prefer the life of luxury. And I also learned a new-found empathy for homeless people.

Madu:

 

Why did you want to take part in Hunted?

It sounded like one major adventure. When I was a teenager I was very much into the military, and was interested in the SAS. I read loads of books like Bravo Two Zero, The One That Got Away, stuff like that. I also remember reading up about the SAS selection process, and part of it being escape and evasion. Part of me, when I was younger, was interested in joining the military, and maybe one day trying to go for the SAS. When I watched the show last year, I thought “I could do that.”  I have the technical ability, from a computers perspective, as well as my experience in cadets, I was in ATC, I was in cubs, I was in scouts, camping is something I’m very familiar with. I thought this could be like an awesome adventure, pure adventure, with no consequences.

 

You embarked on this with Ayo – how did you two know each other?

We’re childhood friends. We met when we were 12 or 13, in our local public library. We had a shared interest in computers and technology and IT. We are polar opposites in many ways, but we have a shared enthusiasm for technology.

 

You both work in the computer and technology industry now. Did you think that aspect of things would come in really handy when you were on the run? And did it prove to be the case?

Yes, and it definitely was the case. Early in my career I was very much interested in security and hacking. In my job as a consultant and developer and programmer, I’ve had to secure companies’ systems, and I’m very conscious of the issues surrounding security, and how to hide myself on the internet. That is one thing we were able to do quite successfully while on the run.

 

You talk about wanting to go on an amazing adventure. How did the reality match up to your expectations?

We didn’t play the game like other people played the game last year. We were quite brazen and out there. It was an adventure, a pure adventure. It was a lot easier than I thought it would be. There were always people willing to help, and I was quite surprised by our ability to talk people into helping us. Every day you never knew where you were going to be the next day, where you were going to sleep. I loved it.

 

You had a nine-week old baby when you went away. That must have been tough!

Yes, it was tough. That was the hardest aspect of the whole journey. And I also missed my first wedding anniversary, which I’m still making up for now. I made sure that my wife had emotional and physical support from friends and family, but obviously it wasn’t easy for her at all. I didn’t initially apply for the show. Ayo applied for it, and he put me forward without asking me, and when Channel 4 started interviewing me, I had a discussion with my wife, and she gave me the thumbs up. It wasn’t the best timing, but when they started to audition us and it began to look like it might happen… The idea of running and being let loose in the country excited me. If an opportunity comes along, you should never let it pass you. Hopefully this will have a positive impact on my career. I think they found some interesting things about my personality type when they psychologically profiled me. So yeah, it should be interesting.

 

What was the toughest aspect of the whole experience?

Ayo and I have very different styles. He’s a bit more brazen, more of a risk taker. I’m more risk-averse. That was quite difficult. He’s my best friend, but we’ve never lived in each other’s pockets. It’s one thing seeing him every day, and another living 24-hours-a-day with him. I found that quite difficult. The next hardest thing was being away from my wife, unable to contact her – it was too dangerous. From the moment I met my wife, we’d not spent a day where we hadn’t spoken. So spending a month away from her was quite difficult.

 

Did you pick up any tips from having watched the first series?

Any plan can be reverse-engineered. If you try to implement a plan, that plan can be deduced. Or you might make a mistake at any stage that throws the whole thing open. So having a firm plan doesn’t always work – my approach was much more to be a tumbleweed in the wind.

 

What were the high and low points for you?

The initial escape was a bit of an adventure. It was a real adrenaline rush. The low point was the day of our anniversary, and there was nothing I could do about it. I felt very isolated.

 

Did you rely on the kindness of strangers?

Yes. That’s my term. I completely relied on the kindness of strangers, and I was extremely pleasantly surprised how open people are. They invited us into our homes, fed us, really went out of their way to help complete strangers. And I was really surprised, I didn’t receive any racism, even though I was in places where you might expect it. In one place I stayed, the pub owner said “There’s not a black person within 50 miles of here.” But I was still given shelter and food. I didn’t experience any negativity.

 

Did you become paranoid on the run? Do you see hunters round every corner?

I didn’t, no. But that’s my personality. I just don’t get paranoid. I would always keep an eye out for hunters. That’s just sensible. If I can see the hunters before they see me, I have the opportunity to run away. If you’re not doing anything, you might as well keep one eye out.

 

How do you feel, looking back at the whole thing? Is it something you’d recommend to others?

Yeah. I can be quite a strain on your partner and family, but if you’ve got the time and the freedom, I would definitely recommend it. But you’ve really got to know yourself before you go on something like this. I know that I’m not a paranoid person, that this wouldn’t have a detrimental effect on me. But if you’re someone who’s paranoid, this potentially could have, because you’re being hunted. But if you know yourself, and you think you’d be alright with it, go for it. It was an adventure.

 

What did you learn from the whole experience?

I learned how willing people are to help strangers. Before I went on the run I was dubious about how much help I would receive. I learned that I’m far more resourceful than I realised.